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Episode 7: PS/SS Chapters 15-16 The Power of Seven






The seventh episode of our new Potter podcast Alohomora! is now available for download. Listen in as MuggleNet hosts Kat, Caleb, and Rosie are joined by guest host AJ of MuggleNet Interactive, pushing onward in our journey through the Harry Potter series.

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Posted by Noah Fried on July 14 2012 08:42 PM (41 Comments)


Comments
You mentioned on the podcast that you didn't believe that Snape told Dumbledore what Quirrell was up to. Although I'm pretty sure in Deathly Hallows during one of Snape's memories. (The one when Snape and Dumbledore were having a discussion about protecting Harry before he came to Hogwarts for the first time.) If I'm correct the last thing that was said in that memory was Dumbledore told Snape to keep an eye on Quirrell. Clarifying the fact that Dumbledore had his suspicions on Quirrell from the start. Also notifying to Snape that Quirrell was obviously up to something
- Golden Snidget on July 15 2012 12:37 PM



On the podcast you guys mentioned perhaps the teachers ruebric for taking points and that you never see a teacher remove points for no reason. But doesn't Snape do that to Harry, Ron and Hermione CONSTANTLY. I don't think there is a ruebrick and the main reason why Mcgonagall took so many points was probably due to the fact something dramatic in her past had happened on that day was making her particularly moody. Perhaps her husband died that day or maybe it was her wedding anniversary that day etc.
- Golden Snidget on July 15 2012 01:32 PM



You raised a question about the value of the copies in the Lestranges' vault at Gringotts, and I found a quote that clarifies this: "Everything you touch will burn and multiply, but the copies are worthless – and if you continue to handle the treasure, you will eventually be crushed to death by the weight of expanding gold!" -Griphook, chapter 26 of Deathly Hallows. So,we can assume it's something like Fool's Gold, a substance that looks like gold but is not as valuable, so it does not defy Gamp's Law.
- Hippogriff on July 15 2012 03:49 PM



In regards to the question of whether there were other things guarding the school brought up by the fact that Charlie's friends were able to go to the Astronomy tower on brooms, I bring you to Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban page 123 UK edition. Sirius Black has broken into Hogwarts and all the students are in the Great Hall. They are wondering how he could have gotten into the castle, " "He could've flown in," suggested Dean Thomas.[Extra text missing] Because the castle's protected by more than walls, you know? said Hermione. There are all sorts of enchantments on it, to stop people entering by stealth." This tells us that yes there are security measures around the castle and that you can't just fly in to Hogwarts. Is this an oversight by Jo? This does happen again in Book six when Harry and Dumbledore fly to the Astronomy Tower after the cave. Can Dumbledore take the enchantments off the castle and if so does this add to Steve's theory that Dumbledore knew more about the events and made it happen? Did Dumbledore take off the enchantments so that Harry and Hermione could give Norbeta to Charlie's friends? It seems that you can take the enchantments off certain parts of the school as shown in book six when they can apparate in the Great Hall for Apparation testing. Thanks fir letting me share my two cents. What are your thoughts? I love the podcast and keep up the great work.
- Bellatwin13 on July 15 2012 08:30 PM



Bellatwin13 thats a good suggestion I rember earlier a couple podcasts a go some one mentioned perhaps the silver contraptions in Dumbledore's office had to do with controlling the magical things and how they ended up where. Perhaps those contraptions have been passed down from each headmaster to the next. I assume most of the contraptions do what whoever suggested it but perhaps some control each enchantment on the school. So for example you could deactivate it or reactivate it. Or just deactivate it in certain areas of the school. etc
- Golden Snidget on July 15 2012 09:13 PM



When Tom Riddle was at school, Dumbledore was the Transfiguration teacher, not McGonagall. I think she may have known about Aragog, but she wouldn't have been there.
I would never drink the unicorn blood. I think one would only drink the blood if they feared death. Dumbledore says "To the well organised mind, death is but the next great adventure" and I live by this quote. If you except you must die, you would never even consider drinking the blood. If you were not afraid of death, why would you drink the blood? I would except that we all have to die eventually, so why live the rest of my life curse?
I would have been able to get through the logic puzzle. I was not able to completely figure it out, I needed the bottles in front of me.
I don't quite remember, but I believe I thought that it was Quirrel.
- FlightQuest91 on July 16 2012 12:47 AM



Something that I noticed about students being out of common rooms at night is bathrooms. We never hear of bathrooms anywhere else but located throughout the school. So, by that, what if a student woke up at 2 am and need to use the lavarotory? Would they get in trouble for being out at night? Or is there possibly bathrooms in the dormitories? If not, and if a student did go out to use the restroom, would they still get points deducted or detention? Just this was a little detail that might be overlooked.
- Rose Weasley on July 16 2012 03:45 AM



And no, I would not drink unicorn blood. Death was created for a reason.
- Rose Weasley on July 16 2012 03:46 AM



In regards to the protection around hogwarts, in HBP, Draco successfully managed to smuggle death eaters into the castle through the vanishing cabinets in the room of requirement and Borgin and Burkes. If I remember correctly, a character mentions somewhere that vanishing cabinets were popular during the first wizarding war. Why were there no charms in place to prevent this from occuring again? I have a gut feeling that Dumbledore knew and even deliberately lifted some charms/ignored warnings to the fact that Draco was using them. Looking through the rest of the series including the PS/SS, there is a consistent trend of security breaches at hogwarts. Quirrel, The Diary, Sirius (Pettigrew), Crouch Jr etc. Do you think that these breaches were all a series of coincidences OR Dumbledore manipulated his position to allow these events to occur at hogwarts with the intention that they could benefit Harry and craft him into the wizard he'd need to be to overcome Voldemort? Let's not forget that they could be overlooked by Dumbledore himself at hogwarts to ensure he was always safe.
- RahRahRavenclaw on July 16 2012 04:39 AM



In the podcast, the question of security came up, because Charlie was able to fly in. I was thinking that maybe this wasn't an oversight that Jo made. We know Hagrid trusted Dumbledore more than anyone else, so it's also likely that he told him about Norbert(a) and Charlie coming to take him. This also supports the theory that Dumbledore is behind everything at Hogwarts.
- killey2011 on July 16 2012 07:50 AM



As for the unicorn blood, I'm not really sure if I would drink it. We can all say now that we definitely wouldn't drink it, but if one was in that position with the opportunity to stay alive, it could go either way. If you were desperate enough to stay alive, I'm sure you would ignore what you said earlier and drink it anyway.
- Hippogriff on July 16 2012 10:41 AM



RahRahRavenclaw I wouldn't conclude Barty Jr. when purposly let them infiltrate the school. I think that was one of the only times Dumbledore was sucessfully duped in the series.

I probably wouldn't drink the blood. I have to agree with Rose Weasley. Death was created for a reason. People are just mainly scared of it because after they die they don't know what comes next.
- Golden Snidget on July 16 2012 02:07 PM



About the rebuttals brought up on the show about my comment on gold (you read one of my comments - squee moment): People above have brought up that Griphook said that those copies in the vault would be worthless so there is that. And also that point about the wizarding community and Muggle communities not always being separate. So they would influence each other. Also, what if most things that Muggles find to be precious, such as diamonds, are sort of all covered under one blanket Gamp's Law? So maybe one of the Laws isn't gold, but instead all precious metals, jewels and materials. Then, because these things can't be created via magic, they have an inherent value within both communities because they would be rarer than things that can be created by a wizard. That leaves the other laws to include things like food, and life, love etc. I think now, that saying one of the Laws is the creation of Gold.. it's a little too specific considering there are only 5 Laws and we know that there are other valuable materials in the world. So having all of those materials under one Law makes sense, right?

Okay, so the Unicorns. I thought this was fascinating. It was established in the podcast that the unicorn hairs can be collected without the death of a unicorn. There could be people whose job it is to track unicorns and pick up stray hairs, or to capture a unicorn and pluck hairs, and then supply these to wandmakers. But we know that the horn is also used in potions. Harry mentions to Firenze that they've only used the tail-hair and horn in Potions. Firenze replies that this is because it is a monstrous thing to slay a unicorn. So.. how do they get the horn..? Do they wait for a unicorn to die of natural causes, then harvest the horn and tail hairs? That would make sense, but I imagine the horn would be quite an expensive Potions ingredient to buy then. After all, it would be easier to obtain the tail-hair than a horn, as you can obtain hair without the death of a unicorn, and also because a unicorn only has one horn.. so it would be rarer. But then why can't they harvest the blood from a unicorn that has already died and use that for healing, as has been questioned? I think that consuming the blood itself would curse you, not just slaying the unicorn. Noah mentioned in the forum that Firenze says you are cursed "from the moment the blood touches your lips" and I think that makes sense if we haven't heard of unicorn blood being used in Potions or for any other purpose. If you can harvest the horn from an already dead unicorn then you can harvest the blood at the same time, and there would be more blood to be collected than horn obviously.. so blood would be more easily available you would think, and it would be used in Potions class then if the horn is.. unless there is a consequence for using the blood. So yes, I think the blood itself is cursed. That makes sense.

As for why Harry's scar hurts, Jo has been quoted as saying that it was the Horcrux in Harry attempting to rejoin the Master Soul in Voldemort. I can't find the specific quote at the moment but I know I read it on AccioQuote. And I think that part of the reason Harry didn't get help about his scar hurting is because of how he has grown up. He's learned not to rely on adults when he has a problem or is hurt. Do you think the Dursley's would give two tosses if Harry was having pain in his scar? He doesn't want to bother people with this because he's had no experience of people caring about that sort of thing at all.
- ZeoRegrediens on July 16 2012 11:08 PM



Golden Snidget - I agree! Sorry I wasn't really thinking there! However with that being said, there were some unusual circumstances in that novel. There definitely were warning signs which Dumbledore seemed to ignore in the novel such as Moody's constant drinking and the stealing of the polyjuice (i wonder if Snape told him about this?). However I see how he could have simply overlooked them in that circumstance - with the TriWizard tournament and all. But still, you'd think that there'd be some sort of security to ensure that this didn't happen. I'm sure this must have happened in the past?

Anyway, I was just thinking in regards to the Unicorns. I know it's looking at the quote from a very superficial level however the quote does specifically make reference to the lips - "you will have but a half-life, a cursed life, from the moment the blood touches your lips." What if you somehow injected this into a person? I know it seems really far-fetched but I'm interested to see what others think about the idea. If it never physically 'touches' your lips, would you still be cursed? Of course Firenze could have just been referring to its consumption in general however it still does seem to be quite specific. Either way, I don't think I'd take the chance of consuming it in any form. What if you took blood from a unicorn without killing it?
- RahRahRavenclaw on July 17 2012 04:20 AM



ZeoRegrediens It says in the first book while Harry and Hagrid are in the Apothcary while in Diagon Alley. Harry mentions seeing Unicorn Horns 21 Galleons each. And about the Quote I heard that too.

RahRahRavenclaw I don't think it was to suspicious that Barty Jr. kept constantly drinking from the flask. As it does mention in the book that he's famous for it. Dumbledore also known for trusting people I believe had some suspisions but most likely ignored them as he wanted to trust his old friend. As for Snape telling Dumbledore about the missing potion ingredients I think he most definately would. I believe those to told each other just about everything. I think yes something like that has happened in the past. But think Voldemort has been gone for 13 yrs. The biggest threat is Sirius Black and Dumbledore knows he's innocent. Also how exactly are you supposed to detect that someone is using Polyjuice potion is entering the school. Even if there was he probably deactivated it when before he entered the grounds. If yoou remeber correctly didn't he come in close to the end of the Start of Term Feast???
- Golden Snidget on July 17 2012 12:27 PM



Snidget I was thinking along the lines of the "thieves downfall" used at gringotts?
However I guess your theory is truly valid that he possibly deactivated the enchantment in this circumstance as indeed he did arrive late. Good point!
- RahRahRavenclaw on July 17 2012 04:48 PM



Correction for my comment from earlier: the valuable materials might be considered under one ~Exception~ to Gamp's Law, rather than under one Law (as there are 5 exceptions, not 5 laws). I mixed my words up.
- ZeoRegrediens on July 17 2012 07:07 PM



I did not figure out the riddle for the potions! I was too impatient to see what was going to happen next! Later i remember regretting that i didn't take the time, but on Pottermore I did not look it up, and got it right on th first try :)
- MapleFeather on July 17 2012 07:21 PM



Well, to go back to the last episode for a moment, may I just say that the theory that there is a little place called Hoot, it my favorite theory so far! And that I'm not sure that I should be angry that Steve was so thourough that there isn't really anything that I could dontribute, or happy! No, I'm kidding, i loved him, it was really wonderful.

Anyway, about whether or not anyone knew about the passage underneath the Whomping Willow, yes, in fact they did. When in the third book Lupin is explaining about his school years as a werewolf, he says that Madam Pomfrey would escort him down to it at the full moon before he transformed. Also that the tree was planted *because* he came to Hogwarts. So I think that means that Dumbledore and Madam Pomfrey at least knew about the secret passage. And also something that was missed about the comment that led to this conversation, it said that It would be hard to get in the common rooms *if they were going to harm or kidnapp a child*. Sirius did go into the common room with the intent iof harming *someone*, but it was a grown man disguised as a rat, not a child. That would explain how he got in, as well as the list of passwords, and that ridiculous knight, Sir Cadagon. But that brings us back to the fact that Dumbledore *knew* about the passage under the Willow, and why he did not have it blocked.
- MapleFeather on July 18 2012 12:21 PM



Just remembered: the tunnel into the Shrieking Shack is not connected to the actual castle at all. As Fred and George tell Harry, there's a secret passageway out of the castle that is blocked by the Willow, but the tunnel itself is under the roots of the tree. So to me, it would be odd for Sirius to have gotten in this way (he'd have to go to Hogsmeade, first, which is swarming with dementors, and then break into the Shack, and then go up to the Willow, and somehow in the tunnel freeze the tree). I'm more inclined to think he snuck through the front doors disguised as a dog under cover of darkness; I tend to think he was living in the Forest at the time.
- Ali Wood on July 18 2012 02:09 PM



Ravenclaw Hmmmmm I didn't think of the 'Thieves Downfall'. I think there was perhaps something similar except it would have to be quite inconspicous if the students and visitors don't generally notice it.
- Golden Snidget on July 18 2012 02:25 PM



Ali Wood If I'm correct in PoA there was a sighting of Sirius Black in Hogsmede at some point in the book. Also I think it was most likely that Sirius just walked on to the grounds disguised as a dog. Then went under the passage way to the Shrieking Shack.

And has anyone even remeber anyone in the book mention that the Shrieking Shack had any other entrance than the tunnel under the Whomping Willow? Besides if there was one wouldn't it be quite dangerous. As the whole reason the Shack was constructed and the Whomping Willow was placed was so that Lupin could attend Yogwarts insuring tye saftey of the other students, staff and villagers. I f there were doors leadong out of the Shrieking Shack. Lupin could've just walked out and bit a few Hogsmede villagers. Not to mention that apparently the Shrieking Shack is suppose to be the most haunted building in all of Britan. Wouldn't quite a few people would like to enter the building to investigate the moaning?
- Golden Snidget on July 18 2012 03:34 PM



Golden Snidget - at the risk of making assumptions, the Shrieking Shack is just that, a shack, and therefore would be made to look like an actual once-inhabited house. The door would likely have been boarded up and there may have been enchantments on it to keep curious witches and wizards away, much like the anti-Muggle enchantments, so that as they approached the building (passed through the gate), they would suddenly realize they needed to be somewhere else.

Sirius was living outside Hogsmede in a cave as a dog. Perhaps he did once show himself in his human form, but I don't have PoA beside me right now to check that. The Dementors were unable to detect him when he was in his Animagus form - as is mentioned in the book. And Crookshanks figured out how to 'pause' the Whomping Willow, so for Sirius to find a breach in the Shack as a dog, he'd likely not be influenced by any enchantments, and could go in a broken window or whatever - remember, the shack hasn't been used in 20 years, since Lupin graduated. From there, he could just head up to the school, and reach the knot that pauses the tree from underneath the roots itself.
- Jormantha on July 18 2012 10:29 PM



Hagrid's judgement has been under question many times. I feel like Steve was correct in saying Dumbledore is in control and aware of almost everything that goes on at Hogwarts, and I think he uses the knowledge of Hagrid's "loose lips" to his advantage, giving Hagrid information knowing that he will slip that information to Harry Ron and Hermione to help them succeed in their challenges in the series. Also, Hagrid telling the stranger in the bar about Fluffy is showing Hagrid's overly-confident perception of the school's protection. Up to this point there have been no known break-in's at the school, so telling someone outside of school about Fluffy as a three-headed dog doesn't seem like a big deal to Hagrid, I don't believe he told all of the details as to what Fluffy was doing in the school, just that he's a giant three-headed dog. Who wouldn't want to discuss that?!?
- lrock on July 19 2012 12:09 AM



Yes, Sirius is spotted in Hogsmeade in the beginning of PoA; apparently, when he arrived there. So he could have been in the Forest the whole time. yes, the Shack is the most haunted building in Britain, but I'm sure the villagers would be scared out of their wits of this "particularly violent spirit" who supposedly lived there (we, of course, know it's Remus biting himself). Sirius lives in the cave, which Dumbledore suggests to him, in GoF, not PoA. Maybe he did go through the Willow, but remember, Harry sees Sirius in dog form and Crookshanks on the grounds. Plus, in Hogsmeade around the shack were dementors. On the Hogwarts grounds, there were not, per Dumbledore's request.
- Ali Wood on July 19 2012 01:36 PM



Ali Wood and Jormantha thanks for your input
First Jormantha What you said about the door likely makes more sense than what I said and probably is probably correct. Also about th cave, I was thinking the samething as Ali Wood. That was most definately Gof.
- Golden Snidget on July 19 2012 02:44 PM



I know you guys on Alohomora talked about the paintings a while a go. But I jut found this on Accio Quote.

Wizard portraits are not living or thinking entities, they are only a 'distillation' of the real person. This 'aura' can give advice or repeat catchphrases but not much more.
-JKR
- Golden Snidget on July 19 2012 05:50 PM



On the potions puzzle on Pottermore, I had forgotten what the right potions were, and I didn't want to cheat using the book. It took me a good 15-20 minutes to figure it out. I later asked my twin sister how she did it, because she hasn't read the books, and I knew she wouldn't try to figure it out on her own. She told me that she picked the two bottles she thought were the prettiest. They just happened to be the right ones.
- GingerRavenclaw on July 20 2012 07:56 PM



What is the Drinking age in the Wizarding World? We know that butterbeer is alcoholic because Winky gets drunk of it in GoF, yet students frequently drink butterbeer. I always assumed there was no drinking age, as the Wizarding World is very old fashioned. Only the stronger drinks, like Firewhisky, have a set age.
- nb_potternerd on July 21 2012 12:11 AM



nb_potternerd Butterbeer is actually not alcoholic. It's only when House Elves drink to much they have a similar reaction to getting drunk. But I don't believe there is any age for drinking in the wizarding world. As in the 6th book Dumbledore and Slughorn both give Harry alcoholic beverages.
- Golden Snidget on July 21 2012 01:07 PM



Or perhaps they follow the laws on drinking set in England; I believe (and I may be wrong) that the age is 16. And no, butterbeer is not alcholic, it's like root beer.
- Ali Wood on July 21 2012 01:38 PM



My first thoughts on the "unicorn" subject is that, maybe unicorns are like phoenixes. Maybe unicorns are somehow magically reborn when they are near death--or ready to die. Not to say that a unicorn catches fire like a phoenix; however, I don't believe unicorns just fade into nothing or back into the ground/nature.
- HufflePuff21 on July 22 2012 03:37 PM



I don't think Sirius used the passage with the Shrieking Shack to get into Hogwarts. The Shrieking Shack will most likely have been closed (with enchantments) so nobody could get into it and Remus wouldn't be able to get out.
But we are forgetting about the passage in the sweetshop! I think Sirius would have gone that way, or he could have gone through the Forbidden Forest.
He most likely will have used the Shrieking Shack as a place to live in when he had got into Hogwarts, or he just stayed in the Forbidden Forest.
- Cissy Flower on July 22 2012 03:51 PM



Well unicorns are in the Fantastic Beasts book but it doesn't mention any bizarre qualities that unicorns have when they die such as being reborn or living eternally or anything like that. So I think we can assume they are just a fairly normal magical creature in that respect. That kind of quality isn't something you'd leave out when writing about unicorns..
- ZeoRegrediens on July 22 2012 07:28 PM



As far as security and how Charlie's friends got on the top of the castle I think it's entirely possible that Dumbledore didn't know. I mean really there's no way he could possibly know everything. Besides they're supposed to be living in a time of peace. Voldemort was supposedly defeated 10 years prior and most death eaters have either gone into hiding or have come back to the good side. With all that said maybe Dumbledore relaxed the security thinking there wouldn't be any attacks on the castle. Sure in book three they would have increased the security because Sirius Black had escaped and remember he had been saying He's at Hogwarts. So of course in that book they would have increased the security and for every year after that. It just seems in the first book it could be plausible that the security would not be strong enough to keep them out.

About the potions one of you mentioned on the podcast that you figured out the answer while reading but I was wondering how that was possible as you couldn't see the sizes or the shapes of the bottles and one of the clues mentions the size of the bottles.

As a side note from an earlier podcast about the invisibility cloak being in the house. What would have happened to it? Remember only the top right hand side of the house would have been destroyed and there for I don't think the cloak would have damaged at all just stuck in the house. And what happened to all the other stuff his parents left him? When did he ever get that? Maybe it would be put in his vault and he could have it when he really needed it.
- texaskid on July 23 2012 09:53 PM



Someone mentioned Sirius getting in to Hogwarts through the Honeydukes cellar. Again, I think this unlikely because, as Ron says, "The owners live over the shop! They'd here anyone break in" and they would also see a random, scrawny dog wander into their shop and basement. However, we should probably suspend this conversation for PoA. Can't wait to get there, it's tied for my favorite book in the series!
- Ali Wood on July 24 2012 09:08 PM



I have to agree with Ali Wood. It would just be so much less complicated if he just walked on to the grounds in dog form.
- Golden Snidget on July 27 2012 10:33 PM



I have to agree with Ali Wood. It would just be so much less complicated if he just walked on to the grounds in dog form.
- Golden Snidget on July 27 2012 10:42 PM



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